Just a few days ago I attended the first edition of the CEO Awards, organized by Business Magazine, an event which brought  together some of the most admired and powerful people in the business environment in Romania.  On the covers of magazines, in their turnover, between forecasts and estimates, these people seem indestructible. They are the kind of people with irresistible courage, a deep feeling of responsibility for so many decisions and for the people who depend on them. A well done and welcomed event in the Romanian business landscape!

In this years’ month of May, together with stage director and trainer Dan Vasile, Trainart conceived a special intuition training program, using specific theatre techniques, developed especially for the “architects” of the business environment.

Six months from the launch of this experimental laboratory, we managed to catch Dan Vasile in between shows to talk to us about the CEO-  stage director duality, about all the different sides of each one, about the connection between the two, and how an artist such as himself can be a mentor for top management.

What lead you to the theatre world and why did you choose to be a stage director?

I like directing more than acting. This is what attracted me most to theatre, the power to create realities, worlds, to feel that things happen the way you want them to happen.

At first I wanted to be a singer, I wanted to become Angela Similea, but I realized you need a singing voice in order to do that, so I gave up. When I was in Deva, at a vocal music club, I met a young lady who told me she was taking singing classes, but also did theatre. That is the first time I heard that word. So I took up theatre. I wanted to make a club in high school, I put up a poster, but no one came. I went to my Romanian teacher, who already had a theatre club, but I didn’t get on with the people attending the club; the theatre they were doing wasn’t motivating me. It consisted of an enactment of literature. In the tenth grade, I knew for sure that I was going to take up acting in college. I failed successfully at my first attempt, so I began military training. I only had two more months before graduating the army, when I saw an announcement at the Petrosani theatre. I introduced myself and took a one year job as body ensemble actor at the Petrosani theatre. I played the role of Stefan cel Mare, Greuceanu. I applied for college once again and failed for the second time, but managed to get into Mr. Eusebiu Stefanescu’s private theatre classes. At that moment I began my personal revolution. I came to Bucharest and acted at the National Theatre in shows directed by Beatrice Bleontz, Victor Frunza, I did television, I acted in the movies of some of my year colleagues from direction.

In my second year at college I realized I liked directing more than acting. This is what attracted me most to theatre, the power to create realities, worlds, to feel that things happen the way you want them to happen. In my third year, I applied for direction for my first time, at the state college. I was testing my strength, because at that time, state college was unreachable. I didn’t get in. That’s when I learned many things about me. I learned that I was afraid, that I was nervous, I asked myself: what kind of director am I? I imagined a director as someone with an iron fist, which is mostly true. Now, after all these years, I can say that.

In the second year I got in. I didn’t want to apply anymore, but went there relaxed because I knew I wasn’t going to make it. I just got married and thought whether to pay for the admission or buy some shoes I really liked. My wife told me: “Dan, be consistent, go and try again”. And that’s when I got in. This is exactly what happens in improvising games. The moment you concentrate on something exterior to you, you forget about your issues, thoughts, and your intuition lets go. I, for instance, can only do things I am passionate about, which burn inside me and keep me awake at night, and that’s not a metaphor!

How did directing change you?

 For me, beyond representing art and Bohemian, directing is discipline. There is discipline even in creativity.

In the beginning I stuttered, I would rather stay indoors and write poetry and I wouldn’t interact with people, I was antisocial. Then, step by step, I began coming out of my shell, I began interacting, listening without thinking of myself. This ultimately took me towards training, where it’s not about what you think; it’s about what the trainee thinks. For me, beyond art and bohemian, directing is discipline. There is discipline even in creativity.

Is the CEO more of a stage director or an actor?

The CEO is a stage director! 

I never was a CEO, but I can assume that being a CEO, as well as being a director, you sometimes face critical situations. The director also works with several departments, such as costumes, scenery, stage techniques, not only with actors. Team coordination and management in order to reach a result is similar. The CEO is a director! The actor is a part of a complex mechanism, like that of a watch. The watchmaker has the overview, because he oils it, adjusts and takes care of it.

What are the main challenges when working with top management? How did you switch from actors to management people?

It’s a different paradigm. When working with actors, they wait for my instructions, and they expect me to run the entire process.

It’s a different paradigm. When working with actors, they wait for my instructions, and they expect me to run the entire process and know what it’s all about, because that is why I came up with it and that’s why it got accepted. It was not a sudden switch. I switched from theatre to business through advertising, where I met clients and understood business communication, then went on to television. Do you know who my main target is, as a stage director? It’s me. I do a show because I really want to. I do it so I can sleep sound at night, without that fantastic pressure. In business however, the target is everyone else but me. I learned how to use my knowledge to help others and, all of a sudden, I know it was no longer about me. General managers know the training belongs to them and I merely facilitate some experiences. This lead to a sort of relaxation I can’t have when working with actors.

How does intuition develop through theatre?

If you leap forward with ease, with the beauty of your own self, you can find more beautiful things than you do when simply looking for an approval.

The moment we go out to experiment, and we do this every day of our life, we are bred into a culture seeking for approval, which forces you to look for it, for an authority to validate you, and then, in your search, your entire process is corrupt. You’re no longer looking for the best, you seek approval from someone that what you had was good. Instead, if you leap forward with ease, with the beauty of your own self, you can find more beautiful things than you do when simply looking for an approval. That search is the one generating stress and blocking intuition.

I think this happens a lot in the management process or the life of a CEO, because what he does needs to be approved by the management plan, by the administrative board. What’s more, since the crisis, nothing gets approved anymore. Intuition is what breaks the deadlock and gives you the solution which, if you manage to use, you’re way ahead others. Otherwise you get into “karaoke capitalism”, and all you do is give second hand ideas and wait for second hand approvals from people who don’t know a thing or two about certain situations. It’s a daring zone which only comes out of honest, direct relationships, without pressure. We leave the dictator zone where I tell you what to do and invite you to certain situations where you play, because game is something we need as a human being. When you play you no longer seek approval, because you’re in a safe environment, and when the game is over, you replaced something in yourself. The puzzle you broke into after years of work and stress is mended and its seams disappear, allowing you to come up with truly ingenious solutions.

Why did you say “yes” to Trainart’s project?

I know Adriana for some time now and Trainart sounded very good. I also liked the niche, training through art, because it’s something which is growing right now. I searched to see what training through theatre, dance, and mime means. I thought it was a very interesting idea to extract from art certain mechanisms which enable the individual. You can even find the art and training combination in the company’s name!  Adriana and I started working together, we made a personal needs map for top management people, and we looked for what we can cut out and paste from the actors’ training zone to the personal development zone of the decision factors. We then picked the things which are useful for creative leadership, the things which make a leader less creative and more talkative, more multitasking.

What does it take for a director to be a director and a CEO to be a CEO? Why can’t a very good actor be a director?

The director is transparent in all the objects and elements.

It’s not a matter of hierarchy. A renowned contemporary theatre actor and director, Peter Brook, publicly stated that some actors gave him the ground idea for some shows. A good actor is as much as a creator as a director. Looking from this point of view, there are actors who can become directors because the can understand other better. A great actor who never becomes a director is usually a master of his technique and emotions; he knows his ways, manages them and he loves himself, he likes the situations which show his value. It’s much more important to me to work from backstage. There’s always the desire to be exposed. An actor always has the need for exposure. The director has a more intimate desire, maybe even bigger than that of an actor, to be exposed at another level, because a director expresses much more of himself, his needs and yearnings. There are much more aspirations in a play than in a single character. What the director reveals is complex and whole. A director can reveal more of himself than an actor, who can always choose to hide behind a character. The director is transparent in all the objects and elements.

While a director always stays backstage at the end of a play, a CEO is always stays on stage. What we are trying to achieve through these theatre training techniques is to help the top manager to connect with himself, so that he can incubate the organization’s values and not be just a simple image; to adapt them to his self, thus becoming a more satisfied individual, both personally and professionally. The two dual states must be harmonized. A CEO is also a human being, with aspirations, desires and passions.